Thursday, June 09, 2005

Social Discourse

A while ago, Dave Budge was commenting about certain remarks left on "Left in the West." (Link above) I enjoy Matt's site because of his perspective, while different than mine is still interesting. So, the news of the day was that Howard Dean has been exploding all over the news, and I pasted a quote from Peggy Noonan in the WSJ which pointed out that you would never hear Bush saying the kinds of things that Dean has been running.
Afterwards, someone pointed out the following:

That’s such a load of BS. Lowering the level of political discourse?

How about telling a US Senator to ‘Fuck Off’ on the senate floor and then saying the next day that you feel good about it?

How about raising hysteria about attacks on Christians or ‘people of faith’ as if the Republican Party has a corner on God?

What about introducing homosexual hate amendments to state dockets in order to get the gay bashers out in force?

What about the mythology that the Republican leadership willingly propogates that Democrats are lazy freeloaders? (Even though the Democratic Party is the party of blue collar workers and farmers.)

What about Bush’s proclimation that “you’re either with us or against us” in reference to the investigation of 9-11 (Good vs. Evil?)? How does that help the world political discourse?

So when O’Rielly, Coulter, Pat Robertson, Frist, Delay, Cheney, Pat Buchanan, Rush, Oliver North, Newt Gingrich, and Sean Hannity deliver comments similar to ones within the speech you quoted above (, those raise the political discourse? I used to be a Republican and they are so full of shit and hate and bigotry and fear. The party of hate and fear. They would not do it? They do it everyday.

I am amazed at the amount of anger on the part of the Left. I would like to point out that the quotes lifted from Ms. Noonan's article were left by the supposed leadership of the Democratic party, which is different than that cited by the commentator above for the most part. Even then, I don't remember Frist, Delay or Cheney, the only party leaders he mentioned, as saying anything so offensive as Dean, Reid et al. Okay, Cheney did say "Fuck off" to Leahy after some pretty rude comments by Leahy in public, and Cheney's remarks were to Leahy himself, not necessarily intended for public consumption.
As to the attacks on people of faith, seems to me that Schumer has made it quite clear, that if you are Catholic, and believe strongly, you are not fit to sit on the federal bench with the idiots who would allow the prosecution of granny for using marijuana. The anti gay initiatives were started after the Mass. Supreme Court decided that it took too long to change minds, and judicial fiat would do just nicely thank you. And Lord only know what we would do without the visual image of rich Republicans versus poor Democrats.
Somehow, all that is supposed to justify the vitriol. Beats me how. I guess it goes back to the playground level of discourse, "He started it first." To which my Dad always replied, "I don't care who started it, stop it right now." And I am supposed to take their arguments seriously because of what again?
Lately, I feel that I can rarely have a civil discussion with Democrats anymore. In fact if someone finds out you are not a Democrat, you are instantly labled Republican. No sense wasting time on any other variant of political orthodoxy. Otherwise intelligent people will cease to consider any view different than their own if you do not adhere to the rigidly prescribed beliefs of the Democratic party. Galileo, watch out!
Democrats have changed though. It used to be whenever I pointed out logical contradictions, or flaws in their facts, the answer was "Well this person I know, who is a lot smarter than me can answer your questions." Thereby absolving themselves from having to think about the issues I raised. Nowadays, however, their answer seems to have changed to "You won't confuse me with your skewed logic and facts." All the while ignoring the obvious contradictions.
I predict as they get angrier and angrier, they will withdraw into their own little shell, pretending that the rest of the world no longer exists. They will be abetted by the rest of us who do not feel as angry as they do and will nod politely, like we do when we meet any crazy person, then hustle away before they become violent.


Matt Singer said...

Steve, Cheney's comments were made after Cheney said to Leahy that he didn't appreciate being accused of nasty deals with oil insiders. Leahy responded that he didn't appreciate being described as anti-Catholic. Which, of course, reminds us that Leahy and other Democratic Senators were accused of being anti-Catholic, which they aren't, since they are practicing Catholics.

Then we can remember that those who opposed Janice Rogers Brown were accused of racism.

Then we can remember how a decorated war hero was accused of selling out his men, lying, and, oh yeah, of committing war crimes.

The difference between the GOP and the Dems here is that the GOP outsources its dirty work, talks shit behind people's backs, and then claims to be part of the moral high ground.

I don't think that's more ethical for a second.

Anonymous said...

I agree with you so on this issue. The hate that I see everywhere on the Left is scary. People that hate that much can do anything and I am afraid of where they are going to go with it.

Even if you aren't a Republican, you can't have a disscussion with them and not be branded a bigoted, racist idiot for not just bowing to them and agreeing with them on all issues.

I guess discussion with out name calling and backstabbing is just to difficult nowdays. We are all poorer for it.

Wulfgar said...

Steve, my response is at my website. If I try to link it here, things appear to muck up for your comments, and I'd rather not do that.

And Sam, if you think all this "hate" on the part of the "Left" is scary, then you aren't paying attention. Take one of your cows, and punch it on the snout every day. See how it turns out.

Anonymous said...

Whether something I've done, very rarely, or it's just the nature of the beast, more often, if I get a mad angey cow it is disposed of. It is way to dangerous, to me, my family , my neighbors, and society to keep that kind of critter around and I ship it off to be destroyed. It's safest for everybody that way.

No, I am not advocating this for humans, Wulfgar. You brought up the cow analogy so i told you my philosophy on it.